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 Post subject: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 28 Feb 2012, 17:53 
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For anybody who's played Warhammer 40,000 I am sure you can understand the pain. ;)

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I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 28 Feb 2012, 21:11 
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Now I know how I'll make my Soul Grinders, Hammerheads and Fire Prisms.

Does it have the right gear on model? ("My Zoanthropes hit it with their Warp Lances, looks like they'll need to bring him back from the dead again")


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 02 Mar 2012, 12:12 
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It's a surprisingly good model. It gives me a bunch of ideas about filling out my own army as well. Especially if I just want to try something out before dropping the money to buy it. You and I should play each other next time we get a chance, Fox.

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Fortune Favors the Bold.
I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 02 Mar 2012, 12:39 
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And if you ever get over here I'll take you with my Traitor Guard

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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 03 Mar 2012, 04:20 
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I've been proxying whole armies and trying them out, so I've got a god bead on who I like, but I do still have a couple to try out. Still no figs of my own, but I want to know who I'll like before I start the buying painting. If you're willing to get them over a long period of time, it seems to cost less.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 03 Mar 2012, 20:34 
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Traitor Guard? I must say that I did not expect you to run an army that was disloyal to the Imperium. Naturally, your army must be purged from the universe.

I have proxied a couple things myself. Mostly super-heavies because I really do not want to spend $800 on a Titan that I will most likely use very seldom and then there is always the concern that I do not end up liking it anyway.

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Fortune Favors the Bold.
I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 03 Mar 2012, 23:06 
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The Chaos Powers predate the Imperium. I call them Traitor Guard so other people know what I mean but in my head the Imperium are the traitors who have followed some jumped up nobody rather than the majesty of Tzeentch.

Of course, they've only done that because Tzeentch arranged it that way but still. Treacherous scum.

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It's a pleasure to meet you. Please call me Kimberley "the Situation" Wymberley.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2012, 05:39 
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Humans are yet new to the glorious change. They will learn the mysteries of the Warp in time. Given the passion that the Eldar brought to us in Slaanesh, can you imagine what their Emperor god will bring us? A fine balance to the Fury of Khorne granting us shoals of stability, though we must assure that he would not stifle innovation granted by the roiling Chaos.

For now we'll harden their iron resolve as we sharpen our claws. The struggle makes us both stronger. It is for the Great Good that none of us get bored. :D

I like proxying to see if you like units before you buy them. The Tau was the first I looked at and I'm still concerned about the vulnerability of their weakness. The daemons have a decent mix, and I haven't looked to see if I can supplement them with Chaos Marines' artillery, snipers and other esoteric units to help with Tzeentch's magic. The Tyrandids & Eldar seem to have too much diversity and options. They depend too much on right moment right unit (especially if you target the tyranids' synapse creatures).

I worry that I'll end up with two armies (though that would make an Apcalypse game interesting).


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2012, 05:55 
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I love the fluff of the guard. And the fluff of Tzeentch - hence Traitor Guard.

I just love that in this world of 9 foot gentically enhanced super warriors, biomechanical nightmares, demons and robotic warriors they're just some guys with t-shirts and laser pointers. It takes balls to be in the Guard.

I also love that Battle Plan A is:
Step 1: Throw endless waves of guardsmen at opponent until they:
(a)run out of ammo
or
(b)die of old age
or
(c)are crushed to death under a massive pile of guardsman corpses.
Step 2: Claim victory

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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2012, 06:09 
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Terrible video quality, but best I could find:


So that's the plan, against Necron especially?

I like mowing them down before they're in range or before they really get to act. Slaanesh's mounts and fiends can chase down turbo boosting jetbikes if they run quick, and a fusillade from a swarm of horrors or a fire warrior team :) Oh and rail guns.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 08 Mar 2012, 22:40 
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You are all vile creatures and I can tell that it remains to me to purge the unclean and cleanse your presence from the universe in the name of the Emperor. }:)

When I first got into Warhammer, I chose the Space Marines because I really liked the idea of playing an elite unit that was fully dedicated to their Emperor and the protection of humanity that they would sacrifice anything in the defense of their belief. Then I found out Space Marines are the most common army to run and that made me sad, but I was already so invested in the army that I couldn't really justify wasting the money I'd spent, not to mention the time invested to model them.

I really like the Imperial Guard as well and would love to field a Guard army, though I am loathe to invest that much more money into the game. Especially since I do not get to play all that much anyway. Otherwise I would have a Guard army. Still, I do love the Space Marines. Especially Dreadnoughts.

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Fortune Favors the Bold.
I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2012, 00:11 
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And, for those of you interested, here is my Space Marine Army. I have another squad of Terminators that I still have to paint and a Veteran Squad that has a couple unpainted marines, but otherwise this is my complete Chapter (as far as models are concerned).

The ones on the left are my Terminators from First Company, as well as the Thunderhawk and Land Raider behind them. On the right are my Scouts from Tenth Company and in front of them is an Inquisitor I sometimes field with my army. The rest are the bulk of my fighting force and belong to Second Company.

Image

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Fortune Favors the Bold.
I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2012, 03:27 
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What Chapter is that?

For a while now I've been half-heartedly working on an online app for playing 40K (with the intention of later expanding it to Warhammer as well.) The intent is that it generates a map, both sides upload their army and it functions as a virtual tabletop. Dice rolls and whatnot are handled by it as well and it stores persisently so moves can be taken when the player is ready rather than both players having to be online the whole time.

It's a fairly low priority project so isn't moving that fast but if I get it up and running I'd love to play you. Might also help you, RubyFox, as it would allow you to play a battle without owning all the miniatures.

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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2012, 12:12 
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I designed my own Chapter. It is from the Ultramarines geneseed, so basically just Ultramarines with my own fluff instead. I named my Chapter the Sons of Guilliman after the Ultramarines Primarch, Roboute Guilliman.

That sounds like an awesome app and I would totally love to play it if you get it put together!

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Fortune Favors the Bold.
I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2012, 14:52 
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Sorry to get off topic, but there is a strategy game with squads of mechs fighting each other, but instead of models you buy, you make them out of Legos. Like Battletech with Legos.

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Atomic Robo: "Get off!"
Dr Dinosaur: "RGNNRRHG!"
Atomic Robo: "Wait a second. I weigh five hundred pounds. I can just fall backwards and crush you."
Dr Dinosaur: "Bah! I have released you. Your mass is useless against my genius!"


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2012, 19:58 
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Do you know what it is called?

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Fortune Favors the Bold.
I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2012, 01:38 
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It was called Mechaton, but had to change the name due to legal reasons. Since it is the 10th anniversary of the game, they are doing a revised version, which is up on Kickstarter. It's another game from the mind of Vincent Baker.

It is now called Mobile Frame Zero: Rapid Attack. It also draws some inspiration from those old 80s mecha cartoons, but I think the reason he made it was he didn't want to get bent over a barrel by Games Workshop.

_________________
Atomic Robo: "Get off!"
Dr Dinosaur: "RGNNRRHG!"
Atomic Robo: "Wait a second. I weigh five hundred pounds. I can just fall backwards and crush you."
Dr Dinosaur: "Bah! I have released you. Your mass is useless against my genius!"


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2012, 13:20 
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I'm planning to get a unit each month for two. Thirty dollars or so a month for years of entertainment. Better than a lot of other options. I think I'll be able to paint them myself too.

I do plan to get more than just a 2000 point army for flexibility/ changes in mood. I like 3/4 of the daemon army, and you can only field two HQs in most battles. (We get a big advantage in Dawn of War deployments).

The virtual map sounds good to play online, figs or no. I'm sure we could eventually find a way to can our models to "field" what we're got. Whenever you're out here, I'm sure we could find more time to play it. Perhaps even visiting the stores from time to time.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 23 Apr 2012, 02:13 
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I had a couple questions about paints. Are the GW paints that much better on the models than other paints? I'm told they're designed to show better w/ fewer coats, but I have no idea about the spectrum they have.

For homemade terrain, if the GW paint is designed for the models, would it be a waste to use them to paint your own terrain? Do they cover well on other surfaces?

Do you find it hard to have layered effects (like veins under skin), or like heated metal, cooling at the edges? Dry bush/chalking for an aged look? High gloss on parts of the model (for a wet look on skin) while keeping a matte on others (like its gear)?


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 23 Apr 2012, 02:58 
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I'm not the best miniatures painter in the world, but the Games Workshop paints in my opinion, are stupidly overpriced. $10 for a small bottle when you can get a larger one for a $1 at any crafts store. They also dry out if you don't use them after a while so you end up with a $5 clump of paint after half the bottle sits unused.

The other question is how "awesome" do you want them to be? Remember E-rock? He just won an award for his painting and I have to say, it was fantastic... actually I'll post to it.

The Nickel is there to show scale.
Image

His ability to realistically detail with such small features is incredible, but I also guarantee this piece took him a really long time to paint. He explained, in great depth once, his process. I'm sure he'd even love to talk about this at some length and could probably do so better than I. (And with that I will give him a shout out to take a look at this.)

Getting to this level of quality takes time and practice. Time and practice I'm not willing to personally invest, but I have fun painting my little Reaper figs all the same. They're decent, but not E-rock's level of awesome.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 24 Apr 2012, 22:27 
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I agree with Alexis' sentiments; Games Workshop paints are way over-priced. I have a few colors that I use for certain details, but otherwise I don't really bank my models on them. Red is one of the hardest colors for me to use because I tend to use really dark colors as the base, so I do use the higher quality Games Workshop red. I also use their "boltgun metal" color for my guns. But for basic colors, I generally just use craft store paint.

I'm not really good at getting a layered effect, like what you mentioned with veins, so I don't really have any good advice for you there. Dry brushing is pretty good for getting an aged look on your models.

This may not be the best process for you, since it really depends on what your going for/what style you like, but I tend to go through and mass-paint my models so I can get them looking decent and combat ready and then go in later and do touch ups and detailing. That way, I can field a painted army without waiting for all the finite details I want to employ first.

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Fortune Favors the Bold.
I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2012, 17:38 
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I prefer to paint one thing at a time (though a mass base coating night works). I like getting the niggily details. I need to think of runes and markings for us, plus how to do them. Though I do plan to make stencils for vehicles and bloodcrushers (possibly the soulgrinders too). I'd like to put runes on the jaws of my screamers (especially if they have unholy might). Then there's the Eldar when I get around to my "shooty army" (Tau's weakness in assault is just too big).

So the model paints (not tester paints as they're to test colors) are plenty good then. Plus I dout you can add a few drops of water to the GW ones to revitalize them. I suspected as much, and I can't blame the store owners too much for touting their product. I plan to use white base coats so I can layer better (especially for the pale Slaanesh units) but have black for a few others (Khorne most likely, possibly Nurgle if I can stomach them), not sure about Tzeentch. Do you use a spray base coat, or a paint on?

Is the GW glue the same plastic melting glue that's used for other models too? Do they have lots of flash or other cleanup that's needed before you get started? How fragile are they really? Will a paper batting be safe enough or do I need the foam tomb that the army carriers use (and I presume you can buy just the foam blocks)? Though I've been temped to get hardware store foam and carve spots for them, of course I'll need a softer foam...


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2012, 10:50 
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We use spray paint. Matte. I honestly think it's pretty much required, just because the coarseness of a matte spray paint keeps your paint from rubbing off your model, which, when you've spent hours detailing to have your thumb smear it off really really sucks. (Speaking from experience. :P )

Not saying you can't do white and it would probably have some cool effects for some things, but black is really good at causing pseudo shadows as your base. Otherwise you have to go through and do it by hand and in the long run it saves you time. If you find your color isn't showing up on the black base, go over it with a white acrylic first and you should be fine. Often, your entire model doesn't need a light base, just some parts. If black is too dark, white is too bright, use gray. It's the same sort of concept with BW levels in graphic design or photography if you have any experience with it.

Christopher would know better with the gluing. He often just uses super gel. It's pretty much super glue but comes in more of a gel form and holds a little better. You can get it in any grocery store. Get super glue remover too!!! You'll glue yourself to something and it's better to have it before you need it. :)

If you go to a shop with Games Workshop products, ask the clerk about what it takes to carry the product and you'll see I'm not making this up. GW has some of the most bizarre policies. It generally costs the shop money to carry the product, you have to carry a certain amount and they have to sell a certain amount to even keep selling it. They'll randomly discontinue items and until you're selling within a predetermined amount you can't order some things to carry in your shop. Which can make it hard to compete with other stores that might be selling better than you. There's a whole load of other stuff. If the shop is pushing GW stuff at you, I highly suspect it's because they're trying to maintain their quota.

But I'm not a war game fan so I'm content with my little Reaper figs.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 29 Apr 2012, 17:45 
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Yeah, I'm trying to decide how much of the company's eccentricities I'm willing to put up with for the game. Like how they've discontinued the template (for flamers & such), likely because of a new edition, but no one seems to know for sure. Makes me want to look into other wargames to see what's out there.

I'm thinking of getting the melty gule (comes off your fingers better) and gluestick for terrain (I do want to make my own terrain).


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 Post subject: Re: Poor Man's 40K
PostPosted: 30 Apr 2012, 11:43 
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If you're looking for other wargames, I personally think Flames of War is really fun. I like their rules better than 40K and their units are MUCH more affordable. I think I got a good starter army for less than $100 and they're cheap enough that I currently have two armies and eventually plan on getting a third one.

Starship Troopers is another fun wargame, but I don't really think it's an active game any longer so getting units will probably be more difficult. I haven't played any other wargames so that's about the best I can do for recommendations.

_________________
Fortune Favors the Bold.
I know the last 2 numbers of Pi.

“In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of the deed could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood… who at the best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement and who, at worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly." --Theodore Roosevelt


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